Reflections Before the New Year

TruthseekerTruthseeker admin
edited December 2020 in Truthseeker Dossier

Truthseekers: ...or rather to myself... I've been pondering over these questions for the past few days. They are thoughts that have existed for a while, but you could also say the recent intel made them seem more relevant. There's a vague causality logic that links the questions, but doesn't necessarily need to be in that order.

Question 1: Why have the Factions maintained a more or less dynamic balance globally during most of Osiris Node's recent history?

Question 2: If not for preference of the color of green or blue, what was the deciding factor for joining ENL or RES?

Question 3: What would happen if one Faction suddenly gains an overwhelming win over the amount of Agents during the Post-Tessellation era?

Question 4: If the sudden surge of Agents for one Faction is a result of influence and not self-motivated decision, who/what would have the access to that Post-Tessellation?

Question 5: What would the Faction with the lesser amount of Agents do when they realized the gap and the hand behind the influence?


- PAC

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Comments

  • MustafaSaidMustafaSaid ✭✭
    1. I would like to bring @wikkedimp 's answer from the Essex Telegram into the forums here since I find a wonderful response: "I believe it was because we had a common enemy and a common goal we needed to understand."
    2. I've personally believed there are a multitude of factors that decide this: subjective ideological preferences and local community status are among the largest.
    3. Probably that the opposite/losing Faction wouldn't take it well.
    4. Whoever controls the levers of power or influence within the Post-Tessellation world. In our current situation; Hulong but in the future....anyone. Maybe even the general public?
    5. Easiest guess: they'd move as quickly as possible to gain leverage over those referenced levers of power(whatever tools are being used to create the conditions of those gaps) and use them as well in retaliation in order to gain the upper hand and give themselves the advantage back.
  • crystalwizardcrystalwizard ✭✭✭

    I can tell you what the answer to your first question is, PAC - but you probably don't want to hear it.


    I have something for you to think about however - the researchers ruined their ability to sense XM. They THOUGHT they knew what the tessellation was, what it did - but they obviously didn't realize it was going to do what it did when they messed with it. Now, I ask you - what if everything they thought they were learning, what they were being told, was a lie? They'd have no way to know, since they broke themselves.

    So I suggest that what they actually did was open the door to something far worse than the Exos they were afraid of - that it's lurking there, slowly sliding into place, and no one (not even ADA) is yet aware of it.

  • 3car3car ✭✭✭
    edited December 2020

    Q5: sue Niantic.

  • crystalwizardcrystalwizard ✭✭✭
    edited December 2020

    To break the 4th wall for a minute:

    1. because Niantic shoved xfac down our throats, and tried to turn Ingress into a version of pokemon go (thankfully Brian came back and didn't allow that) and didn't allow us to compete with each other globally.
    2. there are as many different reasons people joined one faction or the other as there are agents playing.
    3. that faction will get very very very bored and people will quit the game.
    4. your question is a partial statement - but it makes no sense.
    5. They'd give up on the confusing, chaotic rebooted storyline and go play pogo.


  • TruthseekerTruthseeker admin
    https://community.ingress.com/en/discussion/comment/126112#Comment_126112

    Your response helped me connected some more loose speculations. From what you're saying, the nearest example would be:

    Hulong becomes the conjunction that controls the leverages of resources.

  • MustafaSaidMustafaSaid ✭✭
    https://community.ingress.com/en/discussion/comment/126122#Comment_126122

    Yes.


    Granted, for now. Those levers are now hypothetically available to ANYONE with the necessary tools or skills needed to wield them.


    Fun idea to ponder:

    1. What ARE the levers of power in the world of Ingress, particularly the Post-Tessellation era?
    2. How are they used? What particular skills/tools are needed to be wielded?


  • crystalwizardcrystalwizard ✭✭✭
    https://community.ingress.com/en/discussion/comment/126119#Comment_126119

    My fear is that the terror lurking in the shadows that the researchers let in, is already among us and we can already see it, we just dont know it. Hulong bothers me. The sudden change of staff, the document you just said was unexpected, the hints of something sinister just out of sight... bothers me.

  • CocoaPigCocoaPig ✭✭
    https://community.ingress.com/en/discussion/13122/reflections-before-the-new-year

    1. I've wondered that...it hasn't made any sense with it being so close (and at times) equal. In 1218 it was rarely close to equal.


    2. I didn't agree with the idea of being influenced or controlled by an exogenous force, even if there were supposed benefits. That's why I chose to become Resistance.


    3. That's not something I've thought about actually... But I'd expect that much would change, and it would probably cause some tension between factions and maybe even with the corporations.


    4. If what you mean is who would have the ability to do so.... I would expect it would be someone or something that has the ability and knowledge to manipulate the XM to the point of affecting human minds differently in a way that affects their decision making and potential mental function.


    5. This I'm not too sure about but I would think that maybe that faction would attempt to stop whoever was the one doing the individual doing the influencing. Or try to turn said influenced agents against their current faction and switch.

  • RixbanLarxbetRixbanLarxbet ✭✭✭

    1. Either, a. due to the ability to recurse, the balance between the factions are pretty close. or b. how both factions are able to rally agents to their cause.

    2. No apparent reason why I picked Enlightened, and community rocks.

    3. Life goes on, the losing faction will take a small hit to their ego, but technically there's no major disadvantage. Win the next battle in this unending war (not unless we can get Ingress Prime to another year).

    4. & 5. The faction that works together as a team. "Strength in numbers is the delight of the timid. The Valiant in spirit glory in fighting alone." - Mahatma Gandhi

  • aaronviannoaaronvianno ✭✭✭✭
    https://community.ingress.com/en/discussion/13122/reflections-before-the-new-year

    To the first question, it's probably because these things vary by regions around the world and at the same time things are cyclical in nature. But how does one define balance? Are septi scores balanced? Are anomaly outcomes balanced? Or were you referring to the Tessellation outcome?

    You seem to be discounting colour too easily. Colour says a lot in different cultures. Red for example would definitely see a lot more attention easily given its association with strength. The promise of advancement or development is easy to fall for. But it's a double-edged sword. Self-determination has always been a more powerful force. That's why Resistance is a natural choice for many.

    In a 2-horse race, that would be disastrous.

    Though more often than not, agents join the ranks because of someone they know. Familiar faces hold that sway. I don't believe the Tessellation had any influence on that, yet. The Tessellation only reinforced belief among existing Resistance agents. If you're suggesting the NIA has that kind of influence, they're more likely to cause a lot of grief. It comes down to how you determine balance and how people choose their alignment. But within the Osiris node, it feels like all parties would want one side to maintain an edge. It's how the Exogenous have been kept out and causes the kind of power vacuum someone might want to take advantage of.

    At a certain point if you cannot turn the tide, you quit.

    You seem to be hinting more and more at the emergence of a 3rd faction. If some, like Hulong, wanted to use this moment to plant their own loyal recruits. This would be the perfect moment to do so. Free of Exogenous influence and having a weakened Sensitive-less NIA, whoever has the technology could do it.

  • MiketrevisMiketrevis ✭✭✭
    edited December 2020
    1. It is possible that the events of the Tessellation (from the passage to Osiris until its conclusion) were narrated in a neutral way and telling the beauty, importance and values ​​of both factions. If the dynamism is given by the joining of new players and by the changes of faction, however, we cannot ignore the parallel narrative of the anime "ingress animation" which may have "publicized" the faction of the protagonist more than that of the co- protagonist ... but maybe without an excessive imbalance. Finally we can say that the balance is certainly influenced, not only by the expectations of the sensitive, but also by the structure of the scanner (positioning of the choice of the faction) and by the communication that takes place via scanner, via the web (social and other channels), and through the various communities (local, global, faction or xfac) and even in these cases there is evidently a balance given by the interest of both factions to acquire an ever greater number of active users.
    2. The color is in fact the choice made by those who don't know the story or those who have not paid attention to the time of registration, but those who understand immediately the meaning of the choice could make it more sensibly: speaking of these agents, and without repeat the objective position of the two factions regarding the use of XM, I would say that there are cultural / linguistic aspects that can influence the choice. The "resistance" in fact, even cinematically has always been seen as something positive, contrast to an imposed power or to the decision of the few over the many. With the term "illuminati" instead the imagination takes us to the ancient "Freemasonry", to the nineteenth-century circles where wealthy people hid secrets and knowledge. I hope that in the choice the psychic is able to overcome these preconceptions: resistance and enlightened as if they were the expression of political extremisms, but I think it is difficult. (Returning to the subject of colors, however, the "possible" acidity of the green color from a psychological point of view does not help in my opinion). A sensitive can, and is the most frequent case, choose a faction because he came into contact with an agent of that faction (friendship or enlistment). Or he can choose with the intention of "keeping the balance": thus choosing the faction that is not winning at that moment (as happened in my case).
    3. If we take into consideration the single areas or the single regions often the victories are overwhelming ... the perception is that. This does not involve a change of alignment but rather a push for the losing faction to seek out new agents or to make better strategy in future. The important thing is, however, that the rules of the battles always give the possibility, even to an outnumbered faction, to win by compensating with strategy. If this were not the case, the will to confront each other would fail and the game would end. As for the adhesion of the new agents, I do not think that the victories in themselves influence the choice towards the winner: it could instead be the sympathy felt by observing the battle in the places of anomalies, or the human relationships created between potential agents and the agents of one or the other faction, or the impression that that faction gives of itself (whether it be a winner or a loser)... however if the result were influential I would say that then it depends on the character of a person to get on the winner's wagon or accept the challenge and help the loser.
    4. I think the possibilities are more than one: influencing a choice is the basis of all forms of advertising. Who has the power, who has the money, also has the opportunity to invest to influence my choices, today more than in the past through targeted advertising on social platforms. So now that the portal network has got rid of the "advertising" of exogenous and that the channel is free, we just need to find a way to insert the right message inside to condition the minds of sensitives and push them to do one or the other choice. But I don't think that companies like Hulong or IQTech or Visur are interested in a particular message, of one or the other faction, but rather in having control of this channel, control of the network of portals in order to sell the ability to use it. Having said that, behind an anomalous increase of the enlightened agents in my opinion there can only be an enlightened (and who more than an enlightened one would have no qualms about conditioning people's minds? Could it be Jarvis?) And behind an increase of resistance agents there must be be a resistence-alligned (and who but ADA might want to increase the number of resisters in order to increase his power?)
    5. Both factions should work together to ensure that agents unaware of being influenced can once again be able to choose their faction without influence of any kind, but ... is that possible? Or could we instead think of a forced choice, for a certain period, in the faction that suffered the damage? ...surely the faction with fewer agents will have to work one way or another to restore the balance.
    Post edited by Miketrevis on
  • MatiasM20MatiasM20 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Talking about new year, i wish you and everyone at Niantic a happy new year! 🥳🥳🥳

    And hope this and other posts brings something new, interesting and exciting for ingress, not just another useless and forgotten post.

    Happy 2021 for all the humanity.

  • PixelbytesPixelbytes ✭✭✭
    edited December 2020

    Question 1: Why have the Factions maintained a more or less dynamic balance globally during most of Osiris Node's recent history?

    It's a strange phenomenon which I do not have the answer myself. Maybe there are some hidden influences or powers we might have not considered which are balancing the scale?

    Question 2: If not for preference of the color of green or blue, what was the deciding factor for joining ENL or RES?

    The ideals of the faction, the people in the faction. Basically, the power of connections. Part of the reason that I joined the Enlightened was because of an introduction of Ingress through a friend. Since then, I've stick through in the faction as I engage with other fellow faction agents along the way.

    Question 3: What would happen if one Faction suddenly gains an overwhelming win over the amount of Agents during the Post-Tessellation era?

    Well, this might be demoralizing to the weaker faction when it comes to gameplay. However, as we learn from past anomalies, having the numbers does not always mean that you will win the war. We do see comebacks from the weaker faction during anomalies with proper strategies.

    Hence depending the anomaly objectives (or rules to break the 4th wall), having the numbers doesn't mean you can win the upcoming anomalies to come.

    Question 4: If the sudden surge of Agents for one Faction is a result of influence and not self-motivated decision, who/what would have the access to that Post-Tessellation?

    I have no idea on that. Maybe time will tell?

    Question 5: What would the Faction with the lesser amount of Agents do when they realized the gap and the hand behind the influence?

    Well, the faction leaders(meaning Jarvis/acolyte/Ada/Jahan) will try to push their marketing campaign for their faction to increase the recruitment process of agents. Providing in game incentives in joining the seemingly weaker faction. Alternatively, they can try to eliminate the hand of influence

    This brings back to a point that having numbers might not matter in some cases, having quality agents is better than quantity in agents in certain aspects. (Goruck/decoding/Lore knowledge for example)

  • BihotzBihotz ✭✭✭✭✭

    Thanks for the codes!

  • crystalwizardcrystalwizard ✭✭✭
    https://community.ingress.com/en/discussion/comment/126811#Comment_126811

    PAC wouldn't bug your house - but the resistance might.

  • NeothetaaNeothetaa ✭✭✭

    I answered some quick things on the Essex telegram and ended up having a very busy new years, but I wanted to type some stuff regardless of how slow that might've been.


    1: Why have the Factions maintained a more or less dynamic balance globally during most of Osiris Node's recent history?

    I believe this is because of the number of overall active agents. There will always be people who lean either way and when you have big numbers on both sides: a few agents having a break or leaving no longer shake the entire balance completely. Of course, the same does not apply locally, there are many local areas that are completely dominated by one faction. But those local balances are everchanging.

    2: If not for preference of the color of green or blue, what was the deciding factor for joining ENL or RES?

    Originally I was invited to play by a RES friend, or rather it was a group of us who started. For others the team didn't matter so long as we were on the same side. Back then I pondered an entire night, I knew for the sake of sense I had no choice there - but upon just reviewing the factions I knew I aligned ENL [I am an artist who vigilantly pursues for progress in humanity, and my clothes are green]. So in order to cope with the "wrong" decision I decided to not touch the lore.

    Well, years went forth, Ingress had faded as the paths with people forked. Until one day I ended up really longing for a team game again and that's when a new friend reminded me of the existence - followed by uncomfortable silent moment(s) because of my earlier decision. I still decided to continue on RES because I think there should be a very pressing reason for a change and also back at the time there was an overwhelming dominance of green, it allowed me to discover and learn the game again on my own pace and see if I truly enjoy it. I also enjoyed the amount of confusion every time I met another agent, but that sort of silliness only lasts for so long.

    Once I really fell for the game I could not avoid the lore anymore, I had to know more. I also kept making more ENL friends (from other hobbies), which was first cool for infiltrating but at some point you don't want to infiltrate your friends cause it feels bad (and I didn't want my presence to be so scary in regular meetups that had nothing to do with ingress). For the recond there was many nice people in the local RES also, but not every cool person makes for a great overall friend and that's normal.

    So the time for the change had come and I haven't regretted it, there is more to the factions than just colour, I've made so many new friends like a landslide and really just click with the ENL people outside of the game. Ingress is more than a game, perhaps not a game at all.

    3: What would happen if one Faction suddenly gains an overwhelming win over the amount of Agents during the Post-Tessellation era?

    I think there is something in us humans (or an outside influence? the portal network?) that forces us to reset the balance at some point. When a local area is vastly dominated by one faction eventually it pushes people inside to change. It just gets really boring when there is a too big of an unbalance. Not only gameplay-wise, but also if you push the ideals of one faction too much at once and too fast, the correct path ends up not being taken.

    In my view it is the pursuits of the Enlightened and the challenges to the progress given by Resistance that end up slowly but surely taking us to the right destination.

    4: If the sudden surge of Agents for one Faction is a result of influence and not self-motivated decision, who/what would have the access to that Post-Tessellation?

    Logically thinking whoever has the mind units of an area under control and who can control what the messages and influence of the portal network of that faction sends. Us agents do not have the control over what the message is, but we can create and destroy the fields.

    I hope for whoever ends up controlling the message will not misuse their trust in their chosen faction. (Like the exos seem to have misused in Nem node.)

    5: What would the Faction with the lesser amount of Agents do when they realized the gap and the hand behind the influence?

    It depends how much can be done, sometimes the correct thing is to take a break and come back stronger. At times the gap simply becomes larger because too many people are caught up in their regular lives at the same time. You can of course attempt to recruit new people, but I believe you can't simply lure someone to join, they must come with their own curiosity.

  • MrVerseMrVerse ✭✭✭

    I have been away for a while , but I want to contibute in a different perspective :


    Question 1 : Why have the Factions maintained a more or less dynamic balance globally during most of Osiris Node's recent history?

    Answer : There is a drastic change in the global culture of ingress. Faction vs faction tension has been decreasing . It is still intense, but not that intense like it used to be. This is caused by :

    1) The discontinuation of Guardian badge.

    2) Retirement of veteran agents

    3) New agents who are not induced by guardian conflict usually do not really consider other faction as enemy.


    Question 2: If not for preference of the color of green or blue, what was the deciding factor for joining ENL or RES?

    Answer :

    Challenge. Some people like to play in the loosing side and choose the hard way. This is what make them stronger.


    Question 3: What would happen if one Faction suddenly gains an overwhelming win over the amount of Agents during the Post-Tessellation era?

    Answer :

    Does it really matter ? The actual overwhelming victory is in the hand of "the white faction". See how many uncaptured portals across the world.



    Question 4: If the sudden surge of Agents for one Faction is a result of influence and not self-motivated decision, who/what would have the access to that Post-Tessellation?

    Answer : Corporations involved in XM studies are always always counted. However every organization or personals (let's say Azmati clan) who has sufficient knowledge should be counted too.


    Question 5: What would the Faction with the lesser amount of Agents do when they realized the gap and the hand behind the influence?

    Answer : I don't think recruiting new agents or growing the number is the answer. Securing victory in prioritized strategic battle is much more makes sense. It's going to be "quality over quantity"

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